Anthony's Voodoo5 6000 remake project, Seems exciting for sure!

  • This is not the 3dfx prototype V6k, let's get out of this topic please.

    Year 2021, May 28:

    The video card was built, initially and like all the developer's creations, for personal USE and SATISFACTION, because I can do it, I want to do it and I did it.

    a special voodoo2 was also built, just to the satisfaction of the developer, only to be kicked, because I want to do it and I do it.

    Read the interview and visit Anthony's FB page to check.

    Interview: King Shaman 20MB & MGV2020 4MB 2D Video Module Review

    FB Anthony page: https://www.facebook.com/zxc64.hw

    This is the SUX6000 Pci33 / 66 Mhz, second edition prototype and not final version, designed to work on many more recent platforms and made compatible by the Riser adapter, if a person who bought it wants to exploit its full potential, on a motherboard that does not have the i850 chipset, or that does not have a PciX slot. The sale takes place because there is demand, otherwise this too will be kicked, because I can do it and I do it.

    First the dvi / hdmi problem, then the pci problem, then it's too heavy, then ... there are so many things you wrote that I don't remember them anymore.

    However, it is useless to continue explaining, talking and drawing because you don't see, you don't hear ... or you don't want to.

    You said this thing sucks from the start, since there were only rumors of a future project, and we're talking months before the first prototype is released.

    You keep writing, writing, writing that sucks. The embers go out and turn it on again. I think that's enough.

    You want it done in a different way, build your project and finally things will be done the way you want.

    But just repeat the same things, we understand, I repeat, we understand ... but now enough please, enough.

    I repeat, with all the friendships, acquaintances, contacts, you can always do one thing:

    Build your prototype.

    I hope that the discussion ends here and that we stop polluting a thread that could have become interesting, but it will be another useless discussion to read and remember.

    I hope you have now reached your highest level of satisfaction, after all it was what you wanted to achieve from the start.

    Better not to write first than to ask "SORRY" later.

    See You.

  • Well...

    Using PCI will have its benefits. You can use a more modern PC with this card.

    But you are limited by its bandwith. PCI66 is possible if all devices connected to the bus are capable with it. Since there are those crappy onboard sound chips and network chips connected to the bus, you wont get 66 MHz. Even if you disable these devices in the BIOS you wont get the speed because the chips are still physically connected.

    I dont know if it is possible, but I think using PCI Express will be the best choice. A lot of bandwidth exclusive for the device and many boards with more modern CPUs.

    But you still cant play Crysis with this card...

    "Du bist und bleibst a Mensch und du kannst eben net deine menschlichkeit überwinden."

    Dennis_50300

  • Well...

    Using PCI will have its benefits. You can use a more modern PC with this card.

    But you are limited by its bandwith. PCI66 is possible if all devices connected to the bus are capable with it. Since there are those crappy onboard sound chips and network chips connected to the bus, you wont get 66 MHz. Even if you disable these devices in the BIOS you wont get the speed because the chips are still physically connected.

    I dont know if it is possible, but I think using PCI Express will be the best choice. A lot of bandwidth exclusive for the device and many boards with more modern CPUs.

    But you still cant play Crysis with this card...

    What is the bloody point on using a retro card in a modern system :bonk:So I do agree with you all the way there, well pointed out :)

    The system will be held back by this slower card anyway, it will form a major bottleneck, plus you will be limited to workstation mainboards to get use form that 66Mhz Bus, even I know PCI Universal can provide that to a certain degree, still the newer-gen system will be held back by the slower card.

    The card will form the Achilles Heel in newer and faster systems anyways.

    We have seen many benchmarks on how a Voodoo5 6000 of the past 15+ years, 3D mark scores are always inaccurate, it's the programs themself that give you are much more accurate score, there was always that performance wall, test with 1600x1200x16 with FSAA x4 & x8 and see how good these faster new gen systems can be for the card. even with 64MB per chip the 6000 PCI will still hold back the system due to the 33Mhz & 66Mhz PCI bus.
    PC-E won't do much the max performance a 6000 can give is 11.3 GB per sec or 1.33Gigapixels per second at max, it still will hold the system back.

    3 Mal editiert, zuletzt von Gold Leader (28. Mai 2021 um 07:46)

  • This explains that you are against any kinds of critics, so if a design has flaws people are not aloud to mention them? wtf dude?
    That doesn't make you or anyone else that is like that a good developer right?
    Not in my book.

    Mostly Developers gain knowledge from critics they get they can use this info to improve a design, I am seeing quite the opposite here, nothing to be sorry for.
    None of you here want to see the flaws in the design, all I see is ignorance and denial of such things

    Keep in mind people pay a lot of money, paying 1500 USD for a retro card is for most insane, for that reason it better be good or it better get updates from flaws that were found in it's design, these people are paying up for it, big time.
    Most people can build several retro PC's for this amount left alone, a new gen gaming PC, it's of course up to the buyer to do what they want with their money.

    And no I have never reached my highest level of satisfaction, I am a fighter when people keep trying to deny their flaws, when trying to earn high amounts of money from us poor collectors with such things like this, it's never good enough, I am fearless and I will always home in on to such things.

    Have a nice day :)

    Einmal editiert, zuletzt von Gold Leader (28. Mai 2021 um 07:36)

  • i see my presence on this forum is just pointless. i just bored to repeat same things many times.

    feel free to pm me or to see something new on my fb page: https://www.facebook.com/zxc64.hw

    Yet you keep denying the flaws people find in your designs.. so running away to FB is your solution? :/
    Why not try to find a fix for the flaws found I see them as bugs in a design, bugs always have room for fixes or improvements.

    Not every one uses that Social Media Platform either, so there is that as well, just make sure people can mail you as well, especially those that bought things from you.

    And no your presence is not pointless here but if people can't even point out things that can use improving, what is the point on doing something like this anyway?

    There is no such thing as perfection, but there is such a thing as improving a current design from feedback others give.

  • I dont know if it is possible, but I think using PCI Express will be the best choice. A lot of bandwidth exclusive for the device and many boards with more modern CPUs.

    But you still cant play Crysis with this card...

    I already asked about PCI Express and Anthony said it is not possible because of the hardcoded drivers that had to be rewritten if any other Bridgechips were used. Perhaps a liitle FAQ would be a good idea at a point where such answers can be found easily.

    Gold Leader

    You made your point clear that you prefer the old original 3dfx AGP 6000 design, that's absolutely fine. It is also fine that 20 years later a reinterpretation of the card can be build another way like as a secondary PCI card, please accept this too. That is not a flaw in it's new design, it is designed this way because the developer wants it this way.

    To come back to your Jaguar F Type example - if i'd reinterpret the classic car with a new build as of 2021 I'd build it with an electric powered engine, because I would decide my new F Type to be electircally powered - it is the developers decision in the present, not the decission of the developers in the past that build the original. Some may like it, other may not. But at some time we have to agree that there are different points of view for different reasons and accept them

    :)

  • Hmm I respect your input, the Jaguar was literately using a car from 1990 and giving it an Electra engine, that same I saw going along with this remake project.

    And well I never meant a remake of it with an Electra engine, that would obviously be something else, then again if you were to remake the original you would stick to it's original design just to keep the legacy alive, new -gen isn't always the better solution.

    Using PCI is fine, if thatis their choice, no one will be stopping them from doing this, just as long if it's Universal PCI, I mean 3dfx did this 21 years back, why not use this more modern method with this card?
    That didn't really make sense or left alone that didn't add up for me.

    it's just how the flaws are being denied that bothers me, people are paying tons of money for these cards, even being just replica's and if the designer is ignoring any means of critics, what's the point man?

    No one is aloud to give any forms of critics to Anthony, he is full of himself that is clearly showing, to him his designs are always perfect
    That^^^ is what I am seeing here and sorry that is now how the real world works.

    So I will leave them to it, for all I can see this project will die off fast all because you are not aloud to give any forms of critics to the developer of this project and such things never last long anyway, that is the reality with such things.. reminds me of Diedel...

    Each to their own in the end.

    Einmal editiert, zuletzt von Gold Leader (28. Mai 2021 um 09:19)

  • This is a discussion and you made your point. Anyone can point out a point of criticism and that's not forbidden. But please also accept the fact that others have another point of view. You can criticize everyody's project as much as you want, but it is the project owners decision how his project goes.

    If you rebuild your 6000 or your Jaguar or something else you do it the way you want. You may be criticized for some decisions, you may adopt some new ideas out of the criticism, but it stays your project and you do it the way you want.

  • From an outer perspective without any clue to the technical details - thus maybe from a neutral position:

    It's one thing that people should accept feedback. It's the other thing that feedback givers should accept that it's anybodys sole decision on how to react on feedback.

    They can accept it, and change things. They can accept it, but keep things as they are for whatever reasons (too much effort e.g.) They can be of different oppinions.

    In general, repeating the feedback won't change anything, it will only enrage people, because it feels like encroaching. The feedback taker does not have any duties.

    We are Microsoft of Borg. Assimilation is imminent. Resistance is... Error in Borg.dll. Press OK to abort.

  • Thats correct. You have to rewrite the drivers. Its just a software problem. Electrically it should work fine.

    "Du bist und bleibst a Mensch und du kannst eben net deine menschlichkeit überwinden."

    Dennis_50300

  • This is a discussion and you made your point. Anyone can point out a point of criticism and that's not forbidden. But please also accept the fact that others have another point of view. You can criticize everyody's project as much as you want, but it is the project owners decision how his project goes.

    If you rebuild your 6000 or your Jaguar or something else you do it the way you want. You may be criticized for some decisions, you may adopt some new ideas out of the criticism, but it stays your project and you do it the way you want.

    Yea well that I do understand and you have a solid point there!

    But you know how my mind is xD If something ins't right especially when it is compared to the original design, I always tend to mention things, or when bug testing drivers or hardware it's my job for myself to mention things that seem out of place or what ever way how you'd describe it.
    It's just how I am and have been for all the years of my own existence.

    And my bad of that annoyed the crap outta anyone here, even I am pretty sure I did annoy people here. lmao :topmodel:

    In the end we are all ourselves as I am me and no one else, I am just like this my apologies for any forms of complications, it is what it is for that part.

    From an outer perspective without any clue to the technical details - thus maybe from a neutral position:

    It's one thing that people should accept feedback. It's the other thing that feedback givers should accept that it's anybodys sole decision on how to react on feedback.

    They can accept it, and change things. They can accept it, but keep things as they are for whatever reasons (too much effort e.g.) They can be of different opinions.

    In general, repeating the feedback won't change anything, it will only enrage people, because it feels like encroaching. The feedback taker does not have any duties.

    this is something I would back 200%, but it's mainly ignoring most of the feedback that triggered me tbh. as if the developer doesn't want to improve their design even people would mention things with good intention, instead they see us as annoying and always trying to call out blames, as they refer to it.
    They pull shit like that they won't send me running, I always confront the problem than leaving it be, because if everyone would never be aloud to give any sorts of feed back to any kid of project, it's all a at loss.

    Thats correct. You have to rewrite the drivers. Its just a software problem. Electrically it should work fine.

    There is this as well not alone the drivers but the Bios would also have to get updates like improved ram timings for the card or other like things.
    But I am sure that will happen, since well people do pay a large sum for these replica's.

  • this is something I would back 200%, but it's mainly ignoring most of the feedback that triggered me tbh. as if the developer doesn't want to improve their design even people would mention things with good intention, instead they see us as annoying and always trying to call out blames, as they refer to it.
    They pull shit like that they won't send me running, I always confront the problem than leaving it be, because if everyone would never be aloud to give any sorts of feed back to any kid of project, it's all a at loss.

    So for example, you decided to oppose my feedback, and that's fine with me. Opposing, being of a different opinion, does NOT mean disallowing feedback. I have seen loads of feedback here, a lot from you and also from others. Not once have I seen that the feedback was disallowed. I have just noticed people being of different opinions, and deciding not to act on the feedback since they are fine with the project as it is.

    If that "ignoring" triggers you, that's an interesting finding. Dive into yourself and find out why it triggers you. Should it bother you?

    Anyway, I don't want to change the topic of this thread to feedback rules and psychoanalysis :D I'm out again, just with a repitition of MY feedback: I have great respect for people who can pull such a project from zero.

    We are Microsoft of Borg. Assimilation is imminent. Resistance is... Error in Borg.dll. Press OK to abort.

  • this is something I would back 200%, but it's mainly ignoring most of the feedback that triggered me tbh. as if the developer doesn't want to improve their design even people would mention things with good intention, instead they see us as annoying and always trying to call out blames, as they refer to it.
    They pull shit like that they won't send me running, I always confront the problem than leaving it be, because if everyone would never be aloud to give any sorts of feed back to any kid of project, it's all a at loss.

    So for example, you decided to oppose my feedback, and that's fine with me. Opposing, being of a different opinion, does NOT mean disallowing feedback. I have seen loads of feedback here, a lot from you and also from others. Not once have I seen that the feedback was disallowed. I have just noticed people being of different opinions, and deciding not to act on the feedback since they are fine with the project as it is.

    If that "ignoring" triggers you, that's an interesting finding. Dive into yourself and find out why it triggers you. Should it bother you?

    Anyway, I don't want to change the topic of this thread to feedback rules and psychoanalysis :D I'm out again, just with a repetition of MY feedback: I have great respect for people who can pull such a project from zero.

    Well... what bothers me is that the developer is ignoring certain levels of critic they get from people incl myself, mainly things I put against the design it's self, it does have flaws and it's not perfect, nor it needs to be to a certain point.

    The only two things that I don't get is why it not uses a Universal PCI Connector a thing 3dfx did use 21+ years back this eliminates any kind of mainboard support issue for any kind of PCI slot, two notches are always better than one.

    Choosing PCI over AGP didn't make sense either, but hey for the rest the design it's pretty amazing I will give you that, the capacitors and coils as the power relay section is really improved.

    The 33Mhz bus limits the crap out of the card the Voodoo5 6000 AGP would destroy it especially if using FSAA x4 & x8 in high reso's, all because the AGP x1 bus of 66Mhz will allow the card to do more with less of a strain.

    3dfx chose AGP because AGP was used mostly back then and AGP also allowed the 66Mhz Bus speed, PCI64 was needed for the 66Mhz Bus speed and well PCI 32Bit just won't allow this speed, so if using in a 33Mhz PCI slot you are basically castrating the design big time.
    3dfx through this through back then so I don't see why the designer failed to see through that from this point 21 years later?
    Really lost me there.

    Typical Human Error more not, making wrong decisions for critical situations.

    What triggers me that after mentioning that, the feedback I got in return was basically ignoring my critics and that of others, as if he knows everything better than the people that used the originals for years, that have done research for the originals for years, plus the ones that designed the card from scrap at 3dfx it's self 21 years back, that is plain annoying, the ignorance.

    Also seeing a 5500 AGP model with a HDMI made little sense, even though that is an an other subject, good luck finding a Trinitron or Blackshade CRT with a HDMI port, DVI-D would of made more sense. :topmodel:

    But yea that is it really.

    From here on I leave this topic of mine, yea I made this topic from the start...

    Feel free to lock this topic I made and start your own elsewhere.

    2 Mal editiert, zuletzt von Gold Leader (28. Mai 2021 um 10:44)

  • Well Gold Leader, if you really achieved now that Anthony left this topic, thank you in the name of the 99% of VA that opposed your opinion (this was ironic, you said before you cannot detect that usually). VA is actually the forum where things go forward thanks to constructive criticism.

    Your way to argue is very immature because at least every second phrase contains emotional components, which does not fit any kind of constructive discussion. In my job I am reviewing scientific applications that go into millions of € and if someone starts arguing emotionally in front of the panel, this means there is a subjective component in arguments that should always remain objective and this it at least a reason to dig deeper/reject applications. So if Anthony is not listening to you, this means he is a very good developer and just taking the bit of real argument that was in your words. If your impression is that nobody is listening to you, you have to look for the mistake in yourself. The prototype is improved and you keep repeating the same BS again and again and damage this community here. In your facebook group you are able to apologize, why not here, where you do the real damage? Just compare your contribution with Anthonys and then decide what is better for 3dfx community.

    I (personal opinion now) hope that your next post is gonna be about a working prototype from your side, based on your ideas, which I will definitely consider to buy.

    Anthony, again please just try to ignore the emotional words, its not the amount of crappy posts here, there is exciting members with knowledge here (excluding myself from this list definitely).

  • Well Gold Leader, if you really achieved now that Anthony left this topic, thank you in the name of the 99% of VA that opposed your opinion (this was ironic, you said before you cannot detect that usually). VA is actually the forum where things go forward thanks to constructive criticism.

    Your way to argue is very immature because at least every second phrase contains emotional components, which does not fit any kind of constructive discussion. In my job I am reviewing scientific applications that go into millions of € and if someone starts arguing emotionally in front of the panel, this means there is a subjective component in arguments that should always remain objective and this it at least a reason to dig deeper/reject applications. So if Anthony is not listening to you, this means he is a very good developer and just taking the bit of real argument that was in your words. If your impression is that nobody is listening to you, you have to look for the mistake in yourself. The prototype is improved and you keep repeating the same BS again and again and damage this community here. In your facebook group you are able to apologize, why not here, where you do the real damage? Just compare your contribution with Anthonys and then decide what is better for 3dfx community.

    I (personal opinion now) hope that your next post is gonna be about a working prototype from your side, based on your ideas, which I will definitely consider to buy.

    Anthony, again please just try to ignore the emotional words, its not the amount of crappy posts here, there is exciting members with knowledge here (excluding myself from this list definitely).

    Now now now, lets calm down, lets not not get all to sentimental here shall we, please don't get all too over exaggerated, it's still dry outside.

    My comments were pretty accurate actually, yet it was his choice to ignore me, it's really not my issue, couldn't care less.

    If some guy builds something and is earning real money from it from real people he will be confronted with flaws or bugs that are found within the design.

    VA is actually the forum where things go forward thanks to constructive criticism -->> Not entirely what I experienced, but everyone will have their own views to that.

    Anthony ignores critics on his designs, a good developer will take note from critics and feedback and actually reply with thankful replies, a good developer is quite the opposite than what this one is doing.

    And I didn't see much of that happening here, so how can they be a good developer if they ignore feedback or critics on things like the PCI Bus of 33Mhz isn't going to work well or why not use a Universal PCI connector or no AGP?
    A thing some people have complained about in an other forum apart from this one.

    Now I don't see a problem asking those things yet a proper reply was never given which is why I repeat my questions til I get the answer I want.
    That is how my mind works, don't like it, it's too bad, it is what it is.

    That you disagree with me, that is your choice, but that won't change my methods on approaching such situations.

    I just don't agree on some of the designs Anthony used on his cards seeing him ignore certain critics he gets from people and RQ'n to Facebook isn't mature way of reacting either now is it? :')

    it's not my fault that this design isn't perfect, then again it's all in the name.

  • Can someone else confirm that there was a working 2x2 card ever? The photo shows the one without PCB traces...if i remember correctly.

    the 2x2 card was never working only 2 were made as Dummy boards when it comes to 3dfx.

    Quantum3D did however use the 2x2 design for the AAlchemy 4116 and later cards for their AA5 systems like the 8164 for example.

    FalconFly had the 2x2 card before gdonovan & Omgea_Supreme got hands to it:


    As you can see, no traces in the PCB, the other 2x2 card was lost or destroyed. These 2zxx2 Dummy boards used four 3dfx 355 Anvenger chips thatw ere used for the Voodoo 3 3500's.
    3dfx labelled them with VSA-100 decals to cover it up during Comdezx 1999. right is the card from omega_supreme, he repplied the 3dfx VSA-100 decals on the V3 3500 chips:


    Here the 4116 & 8164 as it comes to the 2x2 design:

    Einmal editiert, zuletzt von Gold Leader (28. Mai 2021 um 13:19)

  • From an outer perspective without any clue to the technical details - thus maybe from a neutral position:

    It's one thing that people should accept feedback. It's the other thing that feedback givers should accept that it's anybodys sole decision on how to react on feedback.

    They can accept it, and change things. They can accept it, but keep things as they are for whatever reasons (too much effort e.g.) They can be of different oppinions.

    In general, repeating the feedback won't change anything, it will only enrage people, because it feels like encroaching. The feedback taker does not have any duties.

    To understand well, "some" things must be made public.

    The anger is there, and it is great, because this speech was addressed in February, in private on FB, between the developer and the author of this Thread.

    To the answer: "I thank you very much for the suggestions you gave me but my project continues as I thought it" some retaliation was unleashed:

    1) Banned the developer from the FB channel by the author of this Thread without reason and without consulting the co-founders of the FB channel, even if the contrary was publicly stated.

    2) Statements highly, seriously "OFFENSIVE" towards the developer and those who support him, written in "PRIVATE GROUP", stupidly forgetting that many members of this FB channel are good friends of Anthony and my Friends, deleted a million times on "RECALL", but rewritten again and again, as if something could be deleted on the web without leaving a trace or without leaving an "IMAGE" of what was written initially.

    3) Public and "PRIVATE" contact with collectors / enthusiasts, some "VERY" wealthy, of 3dfx graphics cards, foolishly forgetting, for the umpteenth time, that many collectors and enthusiasts of this FB channel and other channels are good friends of Anthony and my friends, to make the "vsa-100 220" chips "UNAVAILABLE" on the world market by making "BULK PURCHASES", all this to make the "vsa-100 220" chips unavailable, as happened with the chips " Vsa-100 320 ", and not give the developer the possibility to continue with his projects and creations ... I believe that just" THINKING "about such a thing is an indication that there are serious underlying problems.

    4) Boycott these creations in all possible and imaginable ways, personally interpreted by the author of this thread and by those who, like him, do not agree with the creation of these projects ... is the classic example of the Proverb "the enemy of mine enemy becomes my FRIEND "... and this Thread is an" EXAMPLE ", because written by a" wolf disguised as a LAMB ", which attracts the attention of a person interested in the subject with the title:" Anthony's Voodoo5 6000 remake project, Seems exciting for sure! " (also changed to "ATTRACT"), which finds quite the opposite within the discussion Thread, with Feedback Loops, repeating again, again and again ... which personally defends the "NVIDIA Copyright", after have declared several times publicly, just do a google search with one of the "NICKNAME" of the author of this Thread (even if they will be deleted they will still remain on the WEB) "HATE" towards this company for what it did in the 3DFX comparisons.

    Now defend a future buyer from "a wrong purchase", because it has defects ... and then propose a V6K for 3200 € / 3500 € (2 years ago) ... at the same time talking about consumerism, too high prices for 3dfx hardware , of capitalism ... a confusion that only those who write and say can understand.

    I have been trying to be understanding for more than a year, I understand everything, I understand everything, that I swallow bitter morsels and remain silent, that I do not react, that I try to make it clear "directly and indirectly" that the author of this Thread is doing it wrong so ... but nothing to do, it's like in a winter cold, when you think it's healed then it comes back again and more aggressive than before.

    And I stop here.

  • They were removed because everyone else's topics were not seen as relevant, it was 14 pages of Anthony based projects, on an on my group was continuously spammed with this crap, so I put an end to it.
    it is fine an update is posted but don't spam every damn thing nobody asked this not everyone likes this either.I am running a group for 600+ members not 150 Anthony supporters.

    At x-3dfx we have 3dfx fans and not single minded enclosed Anthony fans, go and make your own Anthony group and post his stuff in there, I mean seriously dude? Stop acting like a try hard man.

    After he was removed and after the arrays of Anthony spam was deleted, other members with their Voodoo 2 & Voodoo3 system were given the breathing space they deserved, it wasn't a personal choice if you were wondering, my x-3dfx crew and I decided to do it and it worked just fine.

    Even you are trying to make people believe that with your so called post, but you can't prove much sadly.

    Thing is what ever you are trying is failing hard, it has no effect on me, if I get removed for here it does me nothing.
    So hereby I am going to ask you to lay down your guns and leave me the fuck alone.

    if not expect unforeseen consequences.


    The aftermath awaits.

    2 Mal editiert, zuletzt von Gold Leader (28. Mai 2021 um 13:53)